Transcript 2

Interviewer: Rebecca Staltzman

Adam: 32 years old, athletic build, dark hair, thin beard, technology writer

Julia: 28 years old, pretty, with long, wavy, light brown hair, thin but curvy figure, published author and junior partner at large accounting firm

*

Interviewer: Welcome to another installment of Intimate Portrayals; I'm Rebecca Staltzman. Today I'm here with Julia and Adam to talk about how they got together and some of their more, ah, intriguing interests.

Julia: Hi.

Adam: Hi there.

Interviewer: So why don't we start by talking about how you guys met.

(couple exchanges glances)

Adam: I'll take this one. Um, we met up in Walnut Creek—

Julia: Totally the 'burbs—

Adam: Yeah, totally. I was there for this technology conference—

Interviewer: You're a writer, aren't you?

Adam: Yes, I do some freelance technology writing and I'm also an editor and a columnist at a couple of tech news sites. And the day I met Julia, I was with some of my co-workers at this conference, and we were stuck inside this ugly building for the better part of a morning. So, when we broke for lunch, a bunch of us went outside because there was this little farmer's market sort of thing outside with locally grown food, which is something I'm kind of into.

Julia: And that's where I was.

Adam: Yeah, the guys and I are walking down this path, and we turn a corner and I see the first booth, and I see the girl working at it, and she's the most striking female I've ever seen.

Interviewer: Aww.

Adam: No, I mean it, I was just stunned. And we sort of locked eyes for a second—

Julia: We did.

Adam: And when I looked away I was just thinking: wow.

Interviewer: So did you buy anything from her?

Adam: Well, what happened was that the other guys were blowing the whole thing off, and they were trying to figure out where they want to go to lunch. I just told them I'd meet them back at the conference, later on. And so then I take another stealthy glance at her, to get one really good look at her, and here is this lovely, willowy girl, long, flowing brown hair, and I see that she's putting her hair into a ponytail, with her arms up behind her head. It was a hot day, it was July, and she was wearing a tank top. Anyway, I realize that she's got this beautiful, thick underarm hair, and I'm just even more blown away, because—I'm not necessarily into hairy girls, really—but somehow the armpit hair just emphasizes how beautiful she is, her face, her body, everything about her. It just didn't make any difference at all in how hot she is. I am just stunned, and I realize right then that I have to know her. And while she's doing this, putting her hair up, she looks right at me and we lock eyes again.

Interviewer: Julia, I guess this is a good time to discuss your shaving habits.

Julia: Or lack thereof! Actually, it's just my underarms; I shave my legs and other places.

Interviewer: What made you stop shaving under your arms?

Julia: I'm not sure. It's not that I'm lazy or anything. I think I just like the way it looks, the contrast between modern beauty and the raw primitive. It just works for me. Oh, and also, I like the shock factor. I like the "people say I'm a pretty girl but I have a lot of hair under my arms" sort of contradiction.

Adam: I like it. Although I never thought of it being "the raw primitive." Maybe it is, though. It is sort of primitive in a way. It was attractive, literally, like I was thinking "this girl has balls." It did make me want to meet her. Immediately.

Julia: And so he just walked right up to me and introduced himself.

Adam: I did. Like "Hi, my name is Adam and I'm a Libra."

Julia: (laughing) You didn't tell me your sign.

Adam: Well, I felt pretty cheesy just walking up like that, but like I said, I couldn't help myself.

Julia: So here's this cute, interesting guy talking to me, chatting me up, and I'm not selling any of this gluten-free crap my friend made anyway, so what the hell? Plus, I catch him sneaking glances under my arms, and I can tell that he likes the hair, and that's kind of turning me on. That shock value.

Adam: That shirt was just such a bold, I-don't-give-a-shit-what-you-think move.

Julia: You mean the tank top?

Adam: Yeah.

Julia: And he was looking at my boobs—

Adam: I was not!

Julia: Oh, you were, too. I liked it! I liked the attention. You were looking at my face, too, so it was all good.

Adam: Yeah, well—I could barely believe you were real. I still feel that way, but I was in shock.

(Julia gives Adam a peck on the lips.)

Julia: So at this point, we're talking, and we just have this amazing immediate chemistry, like we know exactly how to talk with each other, and we immediately like each other, we know how to get along. I liked the way he smelled. And so I just asked him out.

Adam: Actually we were talking about where we lived, and when we figured out that we both lived in the City—

Julia: Adam was in the Mission, and I was in Potrero Hill. So I just say: "Why don't we go do something tomorrow night?"

Adam: This was on a Thursday, I think, and so Friday night was kind of obvious.

Interviewer: So where did he take you?

Julia: (laughing) Well, I asked him out, so it was on me. He wouldn't let me pay for dinner, but I did choose what we did. Which was just dinner, and then a little club on Potrero Hill where we could talk without yelling.

Adam: Which was a good idea.

Julia: Yeah, I mean, we could've done dancing or something, but we'd had such a good time talking that I figured we should do more of that. With drinks, of course.

Interviewer: Julia, just curious: what did you wear?

Julia: Well, Adam just had on jeans and some kind of hipster plaid shirt, if I remember.

Adam: Yup.

Julia: And I had on this white sleeveless dress with a flower print ...

Interviewer: Sleeveless is a thing with you.

Julia: Well, yeah, and I picked it partly because Adam seemed so enthused with my armpits and everything. I figured it might get him excited.

Adam: It did.

(Both laugh).

Adam: Anyway, so this club has a little backyard area, and we were back there, and by about midnight there was no one else around us, I don't think. Everyone had gone inside.

Julia: And we'd been talking for a couple of hours at that point. Finally, I'm like: "Adam, we're both just shy of drunk, and you can tell that I like you, so why the fuck don't you kiss me?" Because I was ready at that point.

Interviewer: Ready for anything?

Julia: Well, not quite ready for that, if you mean full-on sex— I actually told him that, later on—but I was ready to kiss him.

Adam: So I did.

Julia: You did indeed. There was no one else around in this club's backyard, which was really kind of surprising, but it meant we could just make out like crazy.

Adam: Yeah, crazy's a good word.

Interviewer: How so?

Julia: Well, I was pretty aroused at this point, and I had to tell him that I was all but ready to go home with him, but there was no way, not on the first night.

Adam: Which I totally understood. I knew I really liked her, so I didn't want us to start things out like it was just a one-night stand.

Julia: Anyway, like I said, I'd gotten a little too excited.

Adam: Keep in mind, we're in public still, so no one's groping or anything. We're just, you know, embracing.

Interviewer: I get the feeling you're leading up to something.

Julia: I came.

Interviewer: Wait, you had an orgasm?

Julia: Yeah. Right there.

Interviewer: From kissing?

Julia: Yeah. It had actually happened once before, a long time before. I was pretty young. And also, I knew someone else that would have this happen, all the time, in fact. I had this friend in high school, Kristen, was all determined to stay a virgin, and she wouldn't let guys touch her anywhere, nowhere. Hands off! But she'd have a big make-out session with some guy, and she'd come, sometimes more than once, just from the kissing.

Interviewer: Wow, sounds kind of unfair for the guy she was with.

Julia: Oh, well, what the fuck, he was just gonna go home and jack off anyway.

Interviewer: True.

Julia: Anyway, OK, so yeah, I came.

Adam: I feel this big noise coming from her throat, and I break the kiss because I'm afraid she's epileptic and she's having a grand mal seizure or something.

Julia: And I just force him back to me and kept kissing him, and that's when the orgasm actually started.

Interviewer: Adam, when did you realize what was happening?

Adam: After she told me. I figured she was all right if she wanted to keep kissing, but I had no idea what was really going on until she stopped to catch her breath, and she told me.

Interviewer: What was your reaction?

Adam: I was blown away, again. This girl is amazing, I was thinking.

Interviewer: Did you go home and jack off?

Adam: (laughing) Yes, of course I did.

Julia: I should mention something: this had nothing to do with Vitamin E—I'm not on Vitamin E, never have been.

Interviewer: For our readers, you're referring to the NeoEstrus, the female sex drive enhancement medication, which is commonly called Vitamin E?

Julia: Yes. I'm not on it, wasn't on it; what happened between us just happened on its own.

Adam: (laughing) She doesn't need help from a pill!

Julia: Apparently not! Anyway. So I wanted to see him immediately, like the very next day, but I had to go to Sacramento on Saturday, and there was no way I was getting out of it.

Adam: So we just went out on Sunday.

Interviewer: Did you spend all Saturday jacking off?

Adam: (laughing) No comment.

Julia: (laughing) I had him just come over to my place on Sunday afternoon—my roommate was out of town, so it was perfect—and I made him dinner. And then, after some wine, I took advantage of him.

Interviewer: You went all the way with him?

Julia: I stood in front of him and took off my dress and my underwear and everything, and asked him to come to the bedroom. We did it with the lights on, in fact, right?

Adam: Yeah, they were on. Loved that. I mean, Julia looks amazing naked, and here she is riding me, grinding and fucking, and she's got her arms in the air, and I'm looking up at her face, and her big boobs, and her underarm hair ... it's amazing I held out for five minutes.

Julia: I think it was more like 10. But we did it about three times that night, so I didn't end up caring when he came. I just made him rise to the occasion again.

Interviewer: And you guys have been living together for ...?

Julia: For a year now. A little over a year.

Interviewer: And how's that going?

Adam: We love it.

Julia: It's like living with your best friend, except that you also fuck.

(laughing)

—

Interviewer: So now we should probably get to the more interesting part of this discussion. Julia, do you want to talk about how this next part started? Remember that our readers don't necessarily know what we're talking about yet.

Julia: Right. Well—Adam likes boobs.

Adam: (laughing) I do.

Julia: Anyway, he likes my boobs, and he has always spent a lot of time on them. Which I like! I wanted him to. But one day, after we started living together, we were doing it, and, no, actually we weren't doing it yet, we were just—

Adam: Foreplay.

Julia: Yeah, we were just doing foreplay. I think we were on the couch, and he had my top off, and I was holding him while he was sucking on my breast. And I was thinking about how pleasant it was, how it felt good and it made me excited and want him. And I remember just randomly thinking: "How hot would it be if I could breastfeed you right now?" You know, like actually give him my milk.

Interviewer: You didn't have milk, though—

Julia: No, I didn't, it was just a thought, just a sudden fantasy. And I realized that I had just gotten about a thousand times more turned on—I really, really liked the idea, all of a sudden. Which surprised me! I didn't expect to have thoughts like that, but here they were.

Interviewer: When did you tell Adam?

Julia: Well, I didn't, at first. But the thing is, I have some friends who do this—who are in a breastfeeding relationship.

Interviewer: You mean, like, post-baby?

Julia: No, they don't have babies. They just induced milk so they could nurse their boyfriends.

Interviewer: Wow. Where would that idea have come from?

Julia: I don't really know; when I had the thought, that impulse, it just suddenly seemed natural.

Interviewer: Some people might think you were imagining Adam as your baby.

Julia: It's not like that at all, though. He's not a baby. But being a woman, I have this strong sense of wanting to nurture someone if I love him, and at this point, I'd fallen deeply in love with him. And so, well, I realized I wanted to breastfeed him—I wanted to know what would be like to make milk, make food, in my body and feed it to him from my nipple. Which, you know, you can say that sounds weird, but it's not, it's not strange for me. It's the most natural thing in the world. It's my way of showing him I love him.

Interviewer: So you talked to these friends?

Julia: Yeah, because I knew they were doing this, that it was real, but I had no idea how they'd started it, how they'd managed to induce milk. I'd never thought about doing it before, never read about it or anything.

Interviewer: And how did they manage to induce?

Julia: Well, the same way I ended up doing it: a lot of herbs and a lot of sucking.

Interviewer: Really?

Julia: Yeah, seriously. I started taking Fenugreek, this herb, a few times a day, and I was drinking Mother's Milk Tea, which has these other herbs, and then we had a schedule. Oh, and I had to change birth control.

Interviewer: Why is that?

Julia: Well, I have this close friend Melissa, and she's in a relationship like this—a nursing relationship with her boyfriend—and she told me she had to get off birth control pills because they were interfering with her body's ability to start milk production. So I switched, too, to the IUD, the ParaGuard IUD that doesn't have hormones. It can make your period heavier, but breastfeeding tones down your period, so—I haven't really noticed much of a difference.

Interviewer: I'm afraid we're jumping ahead, though: how did you broach the subject of nursing with Adam?

Julia: (looking at Adam) It wasn't really that hard. I think we were cuddling one day, and he had started playing with my boobs under my shirt, and I just asked him what he thought of the idea.

Adam: You said, "Hey, if there was a way that you could suck milk from my boobs, what would you think of that?"

Interviewer: Adam, what was your reaction?

Adam: I was sort of stunned. For one thing, though, I didn't even know it was possible; I thought you had to have a baby first.

Interviewer: So she told you that wasn't true—

Adam: Yeah, she explained how she could do it, how she had these friends, and that it wasn't even that hard.

Interviewer: (to Julia) Was it hard?

Julia: Well, I wouldn't say the process was super-easy, but it wasn't hard, no. It just takes dedication.

Interviewer: So, Adam, what did you tell her?

Adam: After she explained that she really could do this, and—this was actually more important—that she really wanted to do this, be able to feed me— that was what mattered to me. If it turned her on, then it was definitely going to turn me on. That's what I figured. I thought it would probably be fun. I mean, it's Julia's milk. It's hers, and ...

Julia: I make it for him.

Interviewer: So now we've really jumped ahead; it's obvious you were successful.

Julia: Yeah, we were. It took about—almost two months of trying. I was on all the herbal shit, and I was sneaking into the Quiet Room at my office building to do hand expression every day, four or five times during the day.

Interviewer: The Quiet Room, as in the nursing room?

Julia: Yeah. We have one on every floor in my office building.

Interviewer: But you haven't actually nursed Adam in one of them—

Julia: No, we never have. I mean—I'd love to nurse him during the day, or in those first weeks, just to practice-nurse, but our schedules are just too crazy. My friend, Melissa, she will text her boyfriend and tell him to meet her on some random floor of her office, and they do nurse there, in a Quiet Room. But we just don't have time for that; we can barely meet for lunch. And also, I'm always afraid someone is going to walk in, when I'm in there. It's fine if it's just me and I'm massaging or pumping my breast, because that's what the room is for. It's a big office, and so I doubt it would be anyone who knows me. But if Adam was there with me, I might have a hard time explaining.

Adam: So we had to do homework.

Interviewer: Homework?

Julia: Homework. When we'd wake up in the morning, while we were still in bed, the first thing I'd do is open my gown, or pull up my t-shirt, or whatever, and put a boob in Adam's face.

Interviewer: That must have been terrible for you, Adam.

Adam: (laughs)

Julia: So I started putting my breasts to his mouth every morning before we even got up. Of course, had to learn how to do it right, the proper latch and everything.

Adam: It's not like normal breast play, breast sucking.

Julia: Yeah, that's right. You have to get a latch over the nipple—really over the areola, the whole thing. My areola was always on the big side anyway—

Adam: You mean both of them?

Julia: Yeah, both of them. But what was interesting is that as we kept up the stimulation, after a few weeks, I noticed that my areolae—is that how you pronounce it? I've never known for sure, "air-ee-OH-lay?" Anyway— I noticed that they got even bigger, even wider. And the guy is supposed to get his lips around most of it, which caused Adam some jaw problems at first—

Adam: It did; I had to learn to loosen up.

Julia: But you did loosen up, though. And so he will get his lips over my areola and then suckle, which isn't really the same as sucking, and he does it in a rhythm, like he sucks and squeezes, and then he lets go some, then squeezes again. And what he's doing is pulling the end of my nipple toward the back of his throat, in and out, which stimulates it to give milk.

Adam: Your nipples started growing around then, too.

Julia: Yeah, they did. And they're still pretty huge. I never ask you about that. Do you think they're OK this way?

Adam: I fucking love them this way. Fucking. Love. Them.

Interviewer: (laughing) OK, then.

Julia: Anyway, so that was easy enough to do: wake up and dry-nurse for about 10 minutes, each boob. And then hand expression during the day. Then at night, when we both got home—

Adam: That was easy. She started taking off her blouse before I got home.

Julia: (laughing) I did; it was a mean trick. He'd come through the door and find me topless, working on dinner. But I knew if I did that, he wouldn't be able to control himself. So I'd start heating a pot of water for pasta, or whatever, and then we'd go sit on the couch.

Adam: Actually we started using the chairs around that time.

Julia: You're right, the chair. I'd sit down—we still do this—I'd sit on the chair and Adam would straddle me. We maybe make out for a few minutes, but then I move his head down to my chest and push my nipple to his lips. And his mouth will open, and we'll get a good latch going, and then, back then, we'd dry-nurse for a few minutes on each boob. About 15 or 20 minutes total.

Adam: No complaints.

Julia: None here either, although I do remember being a little sore the first couple weeks. I think that was mostly when we were figuring out what a good latch was. After that—even now—I never get very sore or tender or anything. It just feels good.

Interviewer: So that does sound like a lot of work, though.